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breaking quake3 compatibilty
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 10:43 am    Post subject: breaking quake3 compatibilty Reply with quote

i appreciate that there are a lot of quake3 mods that people are fond of, but i'd like to see a new game that deliberately breaks quake3 compatibility. openarena aims for strict quake3 compatibility and i think that's a good thing, because it gives the old quake3 mods a new lease of life. however, it does severely limit what they can do. i've seen a lot of interesting suggestions on the forums which couldn't be implemented because they would break compat.

when a game is released it is often working, but messy. the ioquake3 had to do a lot of tidying up to the code and in the same way i think things could be better arranged in other parts of the game. as a mapper i find it really frustrating rummaging through texture folders for a particular texture. i'd like to see the textures sorted and renamed into sensible categories. this would destroy q3 compatibility, but would drastically improve the ease of use for mappers. this is just one example of how breaking compatibility would allow improvements to be implemented, i'm sure there are many more. the game could grow and evolve freely once q3 compat was discarded.

this doesn't mean you would have to go without mods, just that they would have to be re-written based on the new code. if the mod writer didn't want to do this then it would just be an incentive to make a gpl version of the mod, which would be a good thing because then the mod could by integrated into the game as a clickable option, in the same way that unreal tournament 2004 has mutator options. which in my opinion is far better because then mutators can be combined in interesting ways, unlike mods which are all or nothing.

how do you feel about this idea?

if q3 compat was broken, what new feature would you like to see added to the game?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2007 11:13 am    Post subject: Re: breaking quake3 compatibilty Reply with quote

I guess it should be discussed on a pros/cons and individual basis. I there was some particular nice feature that could only be implemented by breaking compatibility with Q3 then I'd vote for going ahead. On the other hand, for other minor issues it could be that we can get away by just messing things a bit and keeping said compatibility. The thing is that once we find a no-no situation everything else can follow, if I'm explaining myself correctly.

In the textures's example: is there something stopping us to reorganize the file structure in a more logical way while keeping the current one in order to keep compatibility?

As for things I'd like to see (not sure if related to this topic):

-Better lightning capabilities.
-Better effects for the weapons (is this dynamic lights?).

"Fuelling off topic babble since day 1."
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 6:07 am    Post subject: Re: breaking quake3 compatibilty Reply with quote

For one thing, breaking Q3 compatibility would have it's advantage when it comes to building something new and fresh, just the way we design it to be. And we wouldn't have to worry as much about conflicting licenses or whatnot. It would obviously take longer, but in return we would learn more rather than just copy/paste old ioquake3 code and pick bits here and there, repaint some scrappy old textures, which might be compatible, or not.

By breaking q3 compatibility I think the main drawback would be that we leave the Q3 community behind but once we get on track with this, then it would generate it's own community, not half as strong as Q3's, but who knows?

Some things that we can implement are bump-mapping, ragdoll physics and properly configured triggers/switches. I actually see many advantages in breaking q3 compatibility since if you look at it that way, Open Arena and Quake 3 doesn't really work together even though they are build on the same source.

To go that one step further, and really make this a unique game, would be to re-create all textures we use, name them according to logical conventions e.t.c

Using q3 engine, q3 mods, q3 textures, q3 models, q3 maps, what would then be new about it? You already have Open Arena, You already have Warsow, you already have Quake 3, why would you need yet another 1999 copy of a game?

- Carl Sandburg -

Nothing happens unless first we dream.
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