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pul3ctf - alpha 3
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pulchr
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 3:27 am    Post subject: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

here's an alpha version of a ctf map i've just begun tinkering with. it's very blocky but i would like some help with playtesting it. the layout is really a spacemap ctf with a rather large central area. and then i connected the bases and middle with a slower but protected path.

should work fine in openarena 0.8.1 (uses the basic textures from pul1ctf).



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PopeJo
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 9:22 am    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

seems balanced so far. =D

it will be a railwhore map again, like pul1ctf, because it is so open and the bases have no walls in the backside, so its sufficient to use rocket-splash to kick defenders into the void, or clear the base with railfire from mid before storming.

but, there's no "perfect" camping place. it might even out then.

I found a shortcut, making it possible to cap in 8 seconds without using weapons. added a demo of it.

maybe the upper mid should be opened a little more, so it harder to dominate that part - but i only tried with bots so far.

well done so far. maybe we can use it in the clantrain tonight and give more feedback :grin:



pul3ctf-a3[fc.vq3.2]00.08.672(popejo.germany).dm_71.txt
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defrag demo. 081.
delete the .txt ..extension dm71 not allowed :(
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PopeJo
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

jack or Tmm ? would one of you upload this map?

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jackthompson
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 1:18 pm    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

PopeJo wrote:
jack or Tmm ? would one of you upload this map?

done :)
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PopeJo
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:10 pm    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

we had a http-referrer error, so couldn't download the map from the server and hence didn't test it..

maybe next time

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pulchr
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:41 pm    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

too bad. but thanks for trying ;)

any other obvious things you can think of apart from the rail-owning and splash-damage-knocking-out-of-the-base "problem"?

might have a working version of pul2ctf for your next practise match too ;)

it's a conversion of pul1duel to ctf.

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jackthompson
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 6:45 am    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

fixed :D
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PopeJo
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 7:43 am    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

thx jack :harr:

@pulchr: none I can think of so far. as you always spawn with a SG the weapon placement is not a big problem.
we'll have to play that map fora while to see if weapon and ammo are sufficient =D



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 11:42 am    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

oookkeeyyy, we tested it and tried different strategies on it rainbow.furver.se/inde...1141#11141

I am just brainstorming here, so I hope you get some inspiration off it. As I only defended, this might be a very narrow view I got of the map:

symptoms:
- you're forced to camp & hide & railwhore - not fun

diagnosis:
- flag area is much too open towards mid and at the same time the base is too crammed with levels, corners and pads.
- getting rail or MH is too risky for defenders, so they stick at the base with rl, sg and ye .. walking circles.
- MH is rather useless for attacks on spacemaps, because you get pushed into the void with rail&mg&rocketsplash - only helps defenders - who are normally not leaving their base for it. it becomes an item for mid-railcampers.
- the main point of action are the bases - camping them leads to endless draw games without any caps.

suggestions:
- try to move the "main point of action" away from the flags.
- make it less edgy. having to walk around 90° corners all the time really slows everything down.
- put the flag behind a pillar, or on a lower level where it cant bee seen from mid (eg. bubctf) to avoid endless railwhoring.
- give an appeal to use jumppad-routes by offering items in the air
- make the whole thing half the size smaller pillars, smaller distances, narrow path and risky bridges !!
- shorten jumppad-routes / block fast cap ways - otherwise it only supports base camping, cause if you loose the flag only 1u from base, you cant return it. once in mid the flagruner cant be catched up (in mlctfbase, or whats it called, its different, because the one-jumppad-speed-capture route is completely open to shoot escapers in the air all the way from base to base)

thats it for now, I hope others can give input, too. this is just an impression and assorted ideas.

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kernel_panic
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 1:44 pm    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

Wow, Popejo, that was quite an analysis. I knew there's something wrong with the map, but I couldn't tell what beyond "it's another space map and I hate space maps".

Yeah, Pulchr, I don't know whether Pope's suggestions could solve it, but as it is now the map is quite boring. Movement is uncomfortable throughout the corridors, and even simple things like dropping from base high platform to one of the lower jump pads needs some control to avoid falling to the void (which sucks). As for the game play, it basically boils down to rail the enemy and avoid enemy's rail. The other weapons down cut it when the guy with the flag takes a jump pad and dissapears from your field of view.

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Joki
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 1:45 pm    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

Here are a few suggestions.
















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pulchr
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:34 pm    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

oh, boy - that was more feedback than i had expected :D
really helpful and together with my notes i have very much that should be done about all the problems.

anyway - i haven't decided yet if i should scrap this map and do something else, or if there's some kind of hope for it. the original idea wasn't good enough and i'm not sure if it worth the trouble :P

many good points and suggestions. don't bother trying out this version any more though :)

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:46 pm    Post subject: Re: pul3ctf - alpha 3 Reply with quote

sure, being self-critical about your creations is a good thing -- but don't overdo it. if i'd be that self-critical i would'nt have published my shitty maps like jokictf1 or deadsimple at all. what counts is, that you are having fun making them at first.

anyways, i should stop replying here -- otherwise this post gets a higher viewcount than the jokictf2-one!!!11112§

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